[SWAT 4] Tactics that make you go, "Hmmmm"

[Columbo]

Hey,
indeed i not really understand your argumentation.
You say: telling beginners the exact position of suspects is not spoiling the game for them, but ordering a grenade does?

I'd rather say exactly that is a main reason for EXPERIENCED players not using the opti: you spoil the game and nullify the (awesome) randomization system of the game.
Of course i know ROUGHLY what to expect in a room (cause i know the maps). BUT using an opti i know EXACTLY what is going on.
That takes away a lot of the challenge.

I never denied using an opti is a pretty safe way and very suitable for beginners (but then they have to use it themselves). That also was not my point! I'd NOT say "never use it".
There are good arguments for and against the use of the mirror device.
But its excessive use at every door is simply spoiling the game for everyone and slows down gameplay (which takes away immersion) - in my oppinion!

Greetings

[Selena]

Originally Posted by Columbo

Hey,
indeed i not really understand your argumentation.
You say: telling beginners the exact position of suspects is not spoiling the game for them, but ordering a grenade does?

I'd rather say exactly that is a main reason for EXPERIENCED players not using the opti: you spoil the game and nullify the (awesome) randomization system of the game.
Of course i know ROUGHLY what to expect in a room (cause i know the maps). BUT using an opti i know EXACTLY what is going on.
That takes away a lot of the challenge.

I never denied using an opti is a pretty safe way and very suitable for beginners (but then they have to use it themselves). That also was not my point! I'd NOT say "never use it".
There are good arguments for and against the use of the mirror device.
But its excessive use at every door is simply spoiling the game for everyone and slows down gameplay (which takes away immersion) - in my oppinion!

Greetings

Fair enough. Do you identify yourself as police to those you encounter?

[Columbo]

Originally Posted by Selena

Fair enough. Do you identify yourself as police to those you encounter?

Usually yes! Sometimes i mimed a pizzaboy, but for some reason that never worked!

[SAS_Random]

Another thing about optiwand usage is that people that use them often are not being considerate of others during its usage. A door or corner can be optiwanded in about 5 seconds. Get it down, sweep the room, type a short abbreviated sitrep that lasts perhaps another 5-10 secs of game time, leader decides strategy, team acts. Make generic keybinds or keep the sitrep brief. There is such a thing as too much information...which i can type as TMI to save time

Pro: 1s 9 facing no CS
Pro: 2s L nfacing R facing 1c down R
Pro: 1s nfacing no c2

Same scenarios...this is an exaggeration for effect, but you get the idea. Some people will wand every f'ing door and take 30-45 seconds doing it. Some will also do it without being ordered, which is super annoying. The leader dictates pace of play and not the nab with the opti and heavy armor who cuts in front of the element and whips out the optiwand.

OptiNab: 1 suspect at 9 partially facing with an AK body armor and a gas mask. he appears to be left handed and have a speech impediment...wait he started walking....nevermind, he's coming back
OptiNab: 2 suspects...the one on the left is about 2 meters away...no he's closer to 2.5 meters away and not facing the entry the other one is on the left facing the door at 5 meters. there is a suspect on the ground to the right at 7 meters wearing blue jeans and an ugly T shirt...I think he has brown hair. There is blood on the floor...
OptiNab: 1 suspect near door, no C2 he's favoring the UMP today...he's patrolling and appears to have a limp. be advised he's about 2 meters tall and looks like Jason Vorhees.

[Orion]

People mirroring every damn door! Why? What for? You will see some suspects or civis but what does that change if you do proper grenade and clearing with ID targets phase? You just losing precious time in hostage situation environment. I would put it as ' If it doesnt work in VIP it doesnt work in missions' . You can mirrow door or place c2 if suspects not suspicious and there were no gun fire before, other times you just putting you and your team into danger. But here we go again and looking at game limitations where some players so used to slow phased approach with AI, that cant play as its meant to be fast and smooth

I just now had few rounds with few RANDOM guys who were not doing mirrow and were clearing rooms as professionals by sticking to walls whole time. That was very satisfying feeling!

[SAS_Random]

Originally Posted by Orion

...if you do proper grenade and clearing with ID targets phase...If it doesn't work in VIP it doesn't work in missions... You can mirror door or place c2 if suspects not suspicious and there were no gun fire before.... some players so used to slow phased approach with AI, that can't play as it's meant to be fast and smooth

I just now had few rounds with few RANDOM guys who were not doing mirror and were clearing rooms as professionals by sticking to walls whole time. That was very satisfying feeling!

Lots of great points, and I quoted the portions that really stand out for me about the need for mirroring.

Proper flash bang placement will blind any suspects focused on your entry point (in general, near the doorway and not bounced hard off the door) . The team uses those few seconds to dominate the room by getting to the corners and covering the middle. CS gas should go middle if possible and not close to the door so your team does not have to even wear a mask. Once CS goes in and you count down 5 seconds before entry, the gas is dispersed, the suspects are choking, and your team can walk in and get compliance.

If you want to be concerned about mirroring, he hit the major issue with it. The team is most vulnerable when it's not moving. Often we have small teams on the server 2-3 and if one is mirroring there is often a direction not being covered. Also Orion mentions mirroring if suspects have not been alerted. The game does not behave with any realism and allows for mirroring of every door. Again, in general, the time and place to mirror is all exterior doors prior to initial entry into the structure and mirroring until first contact. Gunfire and/or yelling compliance for the first time should end the use of the mirror. If you want to take additional liberty and use mirror more, try to maintain a bit more realism with it and perhaps begin on each floor/level with the optiwand until you have first contact on that specific floor. What is annoying is bang and clear a room, then the next door in the same hall gets mirrored and another bang and clear is ordered. That is soooo silly. Wand both rooms, then bang and clear both rooms together if you have the numbers.

It's truly FUN to play the game as tactically accurate as possible.